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Saturday, August 14, 2010


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Little Lost Linden

I thought the speech by Philip went very well until the very end when the female educator hit the audience with her very heartfelt speech about Teen Grid closing. It gave me shivers across my spine that have still not subsided:


Ann Otoole InSL

Search works pretty darn good. Whenever the people in the business sector you search in are not unethical cheaters. LL needs to set a policy about the issues that are trashing up search and enforce them properly. Then search will work rather well for everyone. There is a new set of changes going to roll in on the 18th that includes, among other needed improvements, the fix for the newly purchased parcels never show in search defect. We will see if large operations are going to be penalized for having a wide selection of legitimate products.

What Phillip cannot deliver on is restoring the once lofty positions search gamers that bribed people for picks, paid people to loiter, ran bot farms, and other unethical activities once held. But that is what the loudest screamers are demanding. There is also a need for a better search UI to separate land sales and another view for rentals to keep them out of the main mix. In addition better filters on what is included need to be added to the all search. Like searches for content on shopping parcels only.

But even that will not change such realities as there are tens of thousands of "shoe sellers" in SL. Only so many can fit on the 1st page of results in a search for shoes. If this is unacceptable then make yourself visible in some other manner, like making something people really want and can afford, or choose a different line of business that does not have so many resellers of sculpty kits or template "fashion".

Still haven't seen the numbers for the 3 month period the search was botched during.

Harper Ganesvoort

My daughter will be most interested in access to the main Grid, at least come next March or April.

Jane2 McMahon

16 is legal adult age in many jurisdictions...not sure why it's an issue if they are in SL.


Had been wondering about mesh import. Thanks for including the video.

comoro Infinity

SEACH does not need 5 Devs but just one with a functioning brain and LL does not have it.

Fogwoman Gray

Am I reading this right? Your live concert will potentially have brand new avatars rezzing in for the first time with no idea how to move, talk, do ANYTHING?
My experience is that most new folks rezzing in expect that most everyone they initially meet is there to help them - which is often the case. There is also a LOT of teaching and guidance needed initially, and I suspect that the musicians nor their patrons will be very excited to be expected to provide this in the midst of a concert.
This of course also applies to any other event, club, dance, etc that would have newcomers being birthed there.

Little Lost Linden

"Am I reading this right? Your live concert will potentially have brand new avatars rezzing in for the first time with no idea how to move, talk, do ANYTHING?"

It sounds like it could be fun, and entertaining. Do we know when this is going to happen? I heard the speech about it but didn't hear anything about the exact date of when it will happen.


Teens on the main grid ? No need to have precognitive powers to know that things will sooner or later turn badly.

Hitomi Tiponi

Was glad to see how Philip was quite deservedly rattled by the question about the closing of the teen grid and pissing off all the educators that had been using it. I am at a loss to see why they couldn't parcel off an education grid for the under 16s.

Although he said that he was going to describe what they would do in the next quarter he didn't with most of it - Search had no timeframe, Mesh in public Beta 'should' be by the end of the year. Only the lag improvements seemed to be promised but even then no specific 'we will do this by then' type statements.

Pretty smoke and lots of mirrors - I am hoping for better at the Viewer talk.

Crap Mariner

Acta, non verba.
Deeds, not words.

We've head all kinda of things before.

I will believe it when I see it.


L. Knoller

I always come away from listening to these little speeches with a vague feeling that my way of (2nd) life has some how just been threatened, but I can never quite put my finger on just how I was threatened. There was the year that Mitch Kapor called me "marginal and the dispossessed" (oh wait I think that was an SL birthday, "happy birthday you pioneering weirdo") or the year Rosedale told everyone there were "changes coming that many were not going to like" or words to that effect. This year there are some ideas that I think are good, some that are bad and some that are just plain daft.(or if second life is a society in and of itself, perhaps a little sociopathic)

Things I Took Away:

1) Good Idea: a published roadmap, that they can be judged against, of course it may not work, but to have a definitive list of up coming stuff, will at the very least go a little way to ending the "chinese whispers" game that gets information to the customers second or third hand. It may also serve to calm the "natives" a little. (unless next week we see something that looks like "Q3 10, Fast, Q4 10, Easy, Q1 11 FUN!" that is)

2)Fast, Easy, Fun, Again.. ok here's a news flash , I have fun in SL already, If I wasnt having fun I wouldnt keep coming back, in fact the only time I dont have fun in SL is when I have a Linden telling me I'm marginal and dispossessed, or that there are changes coming that I'm not going to like, or that things are better because they are better by design and that if I'm not liking something its cause I'm not trying hard enough.

3)chris pirillo... wonders where he heard about chris pirillo mm? ... ok well chris pirillo is not a regular internet guy that we, as users of SL can relate to. chris pirillo is.... well, IRL, chris pirillo, would be the type of person that stands on the footpath (sidewalk) outside your home and shouts at the top of his lungs, in his annoying whiney voice, that you are a pervert because he, chris pirillo, didnt like the fact that you drove a ford and not a toyota, cause he hadnt taken his ritalin that day.

4) Viewer Code base, they need (or want) a single dominate code base, I really hope this doesnt mean forcing people onto v2. (I have a sneaking suspicion thats exactly what it means) This ties in with the background updates... you will have to use the viewer code base we tell you to use..suck it up.. embrase the sidebar

5) Not bringing people in the right way? Droping new arrivals straight into the world doesnt strike me as a very bright idea. Rosedale thinks its a good gamble that this is the right way to go, it seems to me that he's gambling on existing users doing the orientation...how many I wonder will show up in a concert already in progess "how do I turn the music on?"... or to a club .. "I want the sex!!" unless he's talking about new arrivals just peeking into sl for a look see without an avie

6) region crossings fixed yippie! group chat I dont use, though i used conference txt chat once upon a time and it was a pain

7) SL (viewer?) crash rates are too high? I use the stock standard 1.23 and at most I crash once a fortnight (two weeks) oooh... he's talking about Vergeltungswaffe 2, well that's made to crash is it not?

8) Mesh + complexity. Giving people "tools" to better control avie complexity, increasing avies per region, control for land owners over scripts, these things all point to a way of increasing preformance by (reducing the load on servers), reducing detail... If mesh replaces prims as a way to reduce complexity without reducing detail in world OK, if not, go buy some faster servers. Im not interested in going back to the graphics of Dire Straits "Money For Nothing" to get a frame rate that is so high it isnt even perceptable by the human eyeball.

9) display names? first i thought he was talking about like how they do it in blue mars, because "there will be ways to see the account name" but who the hell knows, will it negate the need for alts? or will they just be like tags we can wear?

10) teen grid.. now i think i missed something, "the long term goal has been to unify activities on the grids"? really since when? unifying the grids was always "we have no plans" though the last time i remember the subject coming up was round the zindra move. Problems, big god damn problems, 16 and 17 yos are still minors, are they going to be confined too the PG regions? (heres an idea move all the damn PG regions to their own continent (as should have been done instead of moving the grown ups to zindra) and then create a G continent for the kids and keep them the hell away from everyone else.) And what about the poor educators? (that poor woman)

The poor educators, it seems the Lab is a business after all, they courted the educators when it suited them, when it was nice, wholesome, publicity to have teachers on the grid, now that theres no profit in it, its time to get rid of these consumption units? perhaps i'm misreading it, perhaps the kids will be locked up on their own space on the main grid, but it really came across as heartless.

mmm what else... ? ipad? i dont care about the ipad

and yes, I too will only believe it when I see it

Oh and one more thing, a little piece of free friendly advice, next time anyone feels like telling theyre customers "try and do it yourself" i'd suggest you just try keeping your mouths shut

Fuzzball Ortega

Thanks for the post, was curious as to what the rest of what Phillip talked about, all I could find was regarding the Teen Grid closing.

For that I'm playing a wait and see game. I DID email Terrence Linden with a question about the 16 and 17 year olds and areas marked "Mature", his reply stated that anyone under 18 would only be allowed in general areas (PG), while over 18 will have access to moderate (Mature) an adult areas. At least, he said, that's how it stands, and he doesn't see that policy changing anytime soon.

I think they've got a lot of ground to cover before the "Teen Invasion". But, in regards to that topic, best to do a wait and see. I don't think it'd really ruin the fun. I also feel that with the 16 and 17 year olds being close in age to 18, it's not that big of a deal.

Little Lost Linden

"4) Viewer Code base, they need (or want) a single dominate code base, I really hope this doesnt mean forcing people onto v2. (I have a sneaking suspicion thats exactly what it means)"

One thing I noticed was in the Imperial Ballroom, where the majority of speeches were broadcast, the inworld screen suggested that the video's could only be viewed with Viewer 2.x., so I ended up viewing from a web browser instead of inworld. I'm hoping to finally be able to use 2.x a bit more once the crash level is lowered, which, as it sounds, should be very soon.

"And what about the poor educators? (that poor woman)"

Indeed, that speech she gave was blood curtilling. And then the question right after was also not the greatest one to have to answer. You could really feel the pain in those last 2 questions.

"5) Not bringing people in the right way? Droping new arrivals straight into the world doesnt strike me as a very bright idea."

I still think this would be kind of hilarious. I think it would add spice to the game for most users. I can understand the downsides, but I think for this item, the downsides would mostly affect people who take SL too seriously anyway. After all, at it's core, it is a game.

Sometimes I think the business aspect hurts it in some ways. I've had to deal with a lot of 'too serious' types and having an avi fall from the sky right in the middle of some performance just cracks me up.

It would be something that could make me laugh hysterically when I might otherwise just be hanging out somewhere enjoying the regular sl routines, which sometimes, can admittedly be humdrum.

Francis7 Bacon

Good to hear about meshes! After that last story (just the previous day) I was very worried about the future of Second Life That may be the saving grace for Second Life, when / if they ever get released.

How many nails does it take to nail closed a coffin made of... plywood? By choosing to close the teen grid after the beginning of a school year, instead of at the end of the previous year, Linden labs has left many educators in the lurch. It is diffiult for an educator to get approval to use a technology, even when free. Even more difficult to secure long term funding when half the time educators don't even know if they will be employed for next year. Here in California often the budget is often changed in the middle of the school year at the state level and getting this type of funding in advance is almost impossible. Not to mention the resistance to any new type of technology in the first place.

I am sure Linden Labs will be sending refund checks back to the many school districts they just gave the boot to after charging them rent for the 2 months plus they were unable to utilize thier land. Praise the policy and pass the coffin nails.

Gwyneth Llewelyn

There is a slightly different Philip Linden on stage here:

- he has a roadmap!
- he plans on more efficient communication (and perhaps he'll get it right this time)
- his vision is not just a vision: now it has a focus, a strategy, and some detailed tactical implementation
- he apologises (a lot, in fact)
- he might not know everything about SL but at least he's getting some things right; and on those, he speaks with 100% confidence

Overall, a change for better. Philip's "evangelising" speeches are really heart-warming to hear — he's reasonably good at getting an audience excited — but I personally prefer these latest speeches (and blog posts!) where he speaks more as a CEO and a little less as an evangeliser.

It's also great that he started the speech explaining, very patiently, that the sky is not falling, and never was.

Little Lost Linden

I just realized this, I mean I knew it when I was there watching the speech, but, that shirt that Philip is wearing looks like a shirt Elvis used to own. I wonder he Philip purchased it at an Elvis auction or something. There might be a story there. I'll research it a bit.


"16 is legal adult age in many jurisdictions...not sure why it's an issue if they are in SL."

Because 16 in NOT legal in most jurisdictions. Many, but not "all", and there's the rub. We're supposed to be babysitters now?

Henri Beauchamp



SL is and ADULT game, it is BAD enough that LL is segregating adults activities instead of making a "mundane" continent and segregating non-adult activities.

We don't need to deal with tantrums from immature folks !

Sandor Balczo

Legal age is 18 in Italy. I am sure that our media will frown at the idea of minors in a grid which has been advertised for years as adult, let alone that minors try and succeed to access the adult grid most of the time.

Arcadia Codesmith

In the United States, the legal age of consent is set by individual states, not by the federal government. If you live in a town built on a state line, something that might be perfectly legal in one house might be a major felony next door.

How this interacts with "internet predation" laws remains to be seen.

I'm afraid it's going to make age verification virtually madatory outside the Disney zones, and generally have a chilling effect on free expression.

Arcadia Codesmith

Oh.... and a big thumbs-up on meshes :)

Metacam Oh

I don't see anything wrong with 16-17 year old's in the grid, people act like they aren't already there, which is just naivety. You need to cultivate the next generation so people are brought up coming into Second Life, it also adds a lot more residents to the user base and could help the economy.

Nat Merit

"4) Viewer Code base, they need (or want) a single dominate code base, I really hope this doesnt mean forcing people onto v2. (I have a sneaking suspicion thats exactly what it means)"

Philip came on stage during the Viewer Development panel and said that the release of Mesh would "probably force an update" from viewer 1.23 to 2.X. So expect to say goodbye to 1.23 support early next year - here's hoping they've made the sidebar interface optional by then!


FYI that was Ramapo School District teacher Peggy Sheehy who gave the very moving comment at the 1:04:00 mark about the demise of the teen grid and what a tragedy it is. Well stated, on behalf of all of the youth and educators who play and work on the Teen Grid.

Shava Nerad/Shava Suntzu in SL

On dropping noobs into events: I hope they do it by voluntary participation -- I know our events will be noob friendly, as we already are. Trust me folks, there is *nothing* as amusing as a freshly minted resident dropped into an Odd Ball, with no idea what SL is about. Our beloved Tunaverse is a very welcoming and helpful group, and usually the new resident leaves the Odd Ball with a mentor or two.

On the other hand, we asked to have our venue set to mature when the sim ratings system changed, because you have to have it there to even *talk* in open chat about sexual politics/gender issues, a lot of world news and political issues (involving violence, medical marijuana, rape as a tool of war,...).

The LL folks need to give us an R rating (you can swear and talk about adult subjects, but no full frontal,...) so we can welcome the 16-17 year old crowd without totally chilling intelligent conversation of current events.

tree kyomoon

Would love to see an in world mesh editor. Anything I have to build outside of SL in blender or something both lessens the experience and makes the playing field less even.

L. Knoller

@ Nat Merit, and, @ Little Lost Linden

Sigh, Yes I just watched the V2 speech on the stream, in my web browser. I came away with the feeling that, well..

1) The "Scooby-Doo", Mystery Inc, crew are working at the Lab

2) "Project Snow Storm" with be renamed "Project Snow Job" by customers within the next few months.

3) They still dont quite "get it". The usage figures have been quoted as:

Emerald Viewers: 50%
SL Viewers: 42%
SL 2.0 Viewers: 14%
Snowglobe Viewers: 1.72%
Restrained Viewers: 1.19%
Cool Viewers: 0.36%
Imprudence Viewers: 0.29%
Hippo Viewers: 0.21%
Rainbow Viewers: 0.17%

It would seem a good idea (customer service wise) to get V2 to a usage figure of at LEAST 66% by VOLUNTARY migration before they tried a MANDATORY update. If they simply said: "Ok at least 2/3rds of customers will freely choose, and are happy with, (or not even happy, just accepting of) our work before we ram it down everyones throat" that I think would be a good first step. However, I fear 66% would be setting the bar too high for the Lab at this point. Bottom Line the Labs going to do whatever they want.

4) The person who I've come to think fondly of as "Shaggy Linden" starts to talk rather confusedly at around 50mins into the stream, getting his carrots and sticks mixed up I would say. "we're not gunna force anybody to adopt anything" (a few minutes before he had been saying that 1.23 was a dead duck) .. They dont have to see the mesh if they dont want too, dont they get that web on a prim is just way cool, or words to that effect. Its just sad , they cant understand or admit or identify why customers have rejected V2, and in closing Shaggy seems to, of course, blame the customers

which reminded we of this exchange on the forums some months ago:

We sometimes get bug reports that are roughly equivalent to "POPUPS ARE TEH SUK. FIX DEM!" which isn't really very actionable.

Y N:
and we sometimes get linden blogs that are roughly equivalent to "2.0 IS DA BOMB!!1! ALL YOU WHINERS JUST DONT GET HOW KEWL WE ARE!11!" which isn´t really very convincing when you say that about your own product, usually it´s the job of the rest of the world to decide if it´s good or not...

5) Q says "dont judge us by what we say but judge us by what we do" ... sigh ... what they've done is so far ignoe their closed beta testers, ignore the comments on the forums from there open beta testers and ingore and or close jira's they didnt like....

6) Embrase the sidebar!! Resistance is futile!!

@ rikomatic
I'm sorry... Yes, Ramapo School District teacher Peggy Sheehy, I'm sorry, I didnt mean "that woman" I was tired


"We don't need to deal with tantrums from immature folks !"

WHAT? They're FINALLY gonna kick Prokf*cku Neva out of SL?

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